interdictor ([info]interdictor) wrote,
@ 2007-04-14 14:34:00
Previous Entry  Add to memories!  Tell a Friend!  Next Entry
Duke Rape Hoax Case?
What do you guys think about the dropped Duke Rape case? Does anyone believe she was raped? Sexually assaulted? Did she lie? Is she mentally ill?

(Post a new comment)


[info]madbard
2007-04-14 06:35 pm UTC (link)
I say you can only do this Socratic routine if you promise to tell us your opinion after everyone else has spoken.

(Reply to this) (Thread)

[info]ikilled007
2007-04-14 06:40 pm UTC (link)
My opinion is that the girl is mentally ill. It's also my opinion that the guys showed remarkably terrible judgement in having a stripper party for their team, and that their parents obviously didn't raise them well. They should have had better sense than that. Not that bad judgement should be prosecuted by law and false allegations, but they can only blame themselves for being in a situation where these charges could be made and possibly believed. I really don't think the girl was malicious -- just insane. It's not an excuse, of course, and while she probably should not be prosecuted for a crime, she should be in the nuthouse until she's treated to such an extent that she can apologize to the people whose lives she ruined.

Nifong should go to jail for the rest of his life, after he's disbarred and bankrupted.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

(Reply from suspended user)

[info]bizetsy
2007-04-14 08:01 pm UTC (link)
I feel like the fact that he calls it the "Duke Rape HOAX Case" narrows his viewpoint down at least some...

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)
(no subject) - [info]ikilled007, 2007-04-14 09:25 pm UTC

[info]ikilled007
2007-04-14 09:25 pm UTC (link)
Well? Where's your opinion?

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)
(no subject) - [info]madbard, 2007-04-15 12:33 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]tomcatshanger, 2007-04-15 03:17 am UTC

[info]revned
2007-04-14 06:43 pm UTC (link)
I'd like to know why Jesse Jackson is nowhere to be seen regarding this.
I'd also like to know why NOBODY in the media has grilled Jesse concerning this.

(Reply to this) (Thread)

[info]ikilled007
2007-04-14 06:47 pm UTC (link)
You can't possibly be surprised...?

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)
(no subject) - [info]revned, 2007-04-14 07:02 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]biankahakox, 2008-07-15 05:02 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]zenamigah, 2008-07-16 02:06 am UTC

(Reply from suspended user)

[info]twistedcat
2007-04-14 06:57 pm UTC (link)
i really dislike the commentators in the media who have gone after the girl, to the point of releasing her personal information, because THAT BEHAVIOR makes it harder for other women to feel safe in going forward when they have been raped. the whole problem with stepping forward and naming your assailant for rape victims is that they feel ashamed (because there are a lot of messages out there that make them think that it is somehow their fault, on top o fthe needing control issue that will make them think it's their fault) *and* they think no one is going to believe them (becaus there are a lot of messages out there that tell them that no one is going to believe them).

beyond that, i actually have no opinion.

(Reply to this) (Thread)

[info]mcfnord
2007-04-14 07:19 pm UTC (link)
but she was not raped.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)
(no subject) - [info]twistedcat, 2007-04-14 07:25 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]mcfnord, 2007-04-14 07:28 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]twistedcat, 2007-04-14 07:34 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]quotidianlight, 2007-04-14 07:35 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]mcfnord, 2007-04-14 07:37 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]quotidianlight, 2007-04-14 07:43 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]quotidianlight, 2007-04-14 07:50 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]catsluvdmb, 2007-04-15 01:43 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]mcfnord, 2007-04-14 11:06 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]gretcheninofy, 2008-07-13 11:01 am UTC

[info]probabilistic
2007-04-14 06:58 pm UTC (link)
I'd guess that *something* happened - maybe she was drunk or high and doesn't remember exactly what happened, and didn't actually get raped at all. Maybe she went to the police, didn't want to admit that she didn't know what happened, made up something, and it snowballed from there.

(Reply to this)

my 5cents
[info]smeeeko
2007-04-14 07:12 pm UTC (link)
I'm thinking something very WRONG happened.. even if it wasn't rape, it was something.. and yeah, they boys shouldn't have had a stripper at a college party, but they were obviously doing some drinking and whatnot and without better proof there was little to stand on with the case.

I don't know all the facts but if something didn't happen, if no kind of mistreatment happened to this woman & she falsely accused out of malicious spite (which I really doubt.. as I get the impression she really didn't know which guy did what) she did a major dis-service to women everywhere. Either way, because she was unable to prove her case, the next time something like that (hopefully NOT) happens, I think it will be even harder for the next woman.

The media over-exposed this lady and the players. I agree that a woman's good name be protected but if they do find that she filed false reports for whatever reason, maybe they should release her name. It'll be public record if that was the case anyway.

(Reply to this) (Thread)
Re: my 5cents
[info]twistedcat
2007-04-14 07:26 pm UTC (link)
they *have* released her name. and her contact information. and suggested that people harrass her.

so very not okay.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)
Re: my 5cents - [info]quotidianlight, 2007-04-14 07:39 pm UTC
Re: my 5cents - [info]twistedcat, 2007-04-14 07:42 pm UTC
Re: my 5cents - [info]quotidianlight, 2007-04-14 07:46 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]fireba11, 2007-04-14 08:35 pm UTC
Re: my 5cents - [info]belindashort, 2007-04-15 05:36 pm UTC
because i hate saying things and not backing it up - [info]twistedcat, 2007-04-14 08:34 pm UTC
Re: my 5cents - [info]smeeeko, 2007-04-14 07:47 pm UTC
Re: my 5cents - [info]belindashort, 2007-04-15 05:33 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]marketahilyv, 2008-07-16 03:34 am UTC

[info]fireba11
2007-04-14 07:16 pm UTC (link)
It smelled like bullshit in the beginning, throughout the case, and all the way to the end.

I can see no reason why she shouldn't be on trial for bringing false charges -- that's WHY there's laws against doing just that. Was she raped? Maybe - but not by those she accused. Did she lie? Well, there's pretty solid proof she did. Is she mentally ill? I say she's an adult by law and needs to be held accountable for her actions.

Nifong really needs his own ass handed to him. I won't get into what a suitable sanction would be, but he DEFINITELY has no business practicing any kind of law in this country.

The Duke Lacrosse players may or may not be upstanding citizens, but they're clearly not guilty of any wrong-doing in this case. The past year is something that each of them will never get back.

(Reply to this) (Thread)

[info]beckyjohez
2008-07-15 05:28 am UTC (link)
This is neglect, there is just no way around it. Why has she not been allowed outside for fresh air or company, or out of her room even.

(Reply to this) (Parent)

[info]quotidianlight
2007-04-14 07:27 pm UTC (link)
I do believe she was drugged and raped by someone and that her fuzzy story is the result of date rape substances. When a person experiences trauma it is very common psycological trait to fill in memory blanks if they don't remember everything or are confused. This is actually one of the reasons why witnesses are so damned unreliable. As for DNA, if she was drugged she could have been raped with a broom handle or the perp (especially an educated one) could have used a condom. But you don't just get vaginal laserations and bruises in that area that easily. My problem is both how the case was handled and exactly how are law enforcment and the media going to handle the higher occurances of rapists using condoms and drugs!

(Reply to this) (Thread)

[info]unclebill35
2007-04-14 08:30 pm UTC (link)
"Vaginal lacerations and bruising" were a hoax/lie perpetrated by Nifong and run through the media. The ACTUAL report said "diffuse edema", as in a general, but not in one specific area, swelling, but NO BRUISING was specifically mentioned.

She had numerous "escort appointments" in the days/hours before the party, and at least during one of those she performed with a vibrator for a couple in their hotel room. She had the semen from AT LEAST FOUR men in her anus, vagina, and panties that she was wearing, and NONE of the semen was matched up with any of the 46 Lacrosse player's DNA. The second stripper, Kim Roberts, has made statements that her story is "a crock", and she was never outside her sight for five minutes.

http://www.newsobserver.com/1185/story/448437.html

Kim Roberts also said that Mangum said to her 'Go ahead, put marks on me. That's what I want. Go ahead.'

http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/LegalCenter/story?id=2614634&page=1

Yes, Crystal Gail Mangum may have been raped or sexually assaulted, but it wasn't at the house on Buchanan Street that night. It was either before or after that party.

The Attourney General of NC (Roy Cooper) alluded to her mental instability during his press concerence, saying they felt she actually believed her mutually contradicting changing stories.

http://abclocal.go.com/wtvd/story?section=triangle&id=5200238

She was prescribed medication for bipolar disorder, and anti-psychotic medications. She has at least one mental illness. She lied in each and every different version of her story.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)
(no subject) - [info]quotidianlight, 2007-04-14 09:39 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]myskat, 2007-04-14 10:11 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]myskat, 2007-04-14 10:08 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]unclebill35, 2007-04-14 10:45 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]myskat, 2007-04-14 11:14 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]myskat, 2007-04-14 11:18 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]myskat, 2007-04-14 11:19 pm UTC

(Deleted post)

[info]amydebiw
2008-07-14 09:40 am UTC (link)
Let us have no one say of the media in this era, as Senator Hiram Johnson did in “The first casualty when war comes, is truth.

(Reply to this) (Parent)
(no subject) - [info]victorialunec, 2008-07-16 12:23 am UTC

[info]sainteelyse
2007-04-14 07:48 pm UTC (link)
no i don't think she was raped and i don't know enough about her to say whether or not she is mentally ill. i think that it is amazing that the world jumped with both feet on all the guys and put her on this wonderfully high pedestal only to realize many months later that she was "misaken". i think that many men hire stippers for things and it's not for anyone else to judge them on their morals or lack there of. those who live in glass houses and whatnot. i'm glad it's finally over for everyone and perhaps now the guys can get on with their lives and i hope that the lies that were said and then perpetuated by the media do not follow and haunt them for infinity. i think that unfortunately someone saw an opportunity to perhaps take advantage of a group of guys who may have shown poor judgement in their choice of party entertainment. who is to say it's not a thing of making the most of a situation and perhaps there can be some sort of monitary windfall out of it. one could easily assume that the boys have money, or their families do, because they go to duke. i'm not sure there is any way to find out the 100% truth on any part of the situation and perhaps it would be best to let things go now that everything has been resolved as far as the legalities are concerned.

(Reply to this) (Thread)

(Reply from suspended user)

[info]ms_cantrell
2007-04-14 08:00 pm UTC (link)
the guys showed really bad judgement, the girl either saw an opportunity to exploit, or reacted hysterically to a perceived threat, and that stupid Nifong bastard saw an opportunity to make a name for himself and sacrifice whatever shred of integrity or self respect he may ever have had.

i feel sorry for those guys; glad that their apparent innocence is being broadcast so much, to make up very slightly for their assumed guilt.

(Reply to this) (Thread)

[info]phanatic
2007-04-14 09:05 pm UTC (link)
the guys showed really bad judgement

In doing what? One of them was in a fucking *cab* at the time he was supposed to be raping the stripper.

What was his bad judgement? Not being anywhere near the supposed location of a supposed crime at the time it was supposedly occurring?

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)
(no subject) - [info]ms_cantrell, 2007-04-14 09:12 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]ikilled007, 2007-04-14 09:15 pm UTC

[info]greeklady
2007-04-14 08:08 pm UTC (link)
Every lie has a foothold in truth. I knew strippers. More than half were prositutes on the side. The strippers I knew tend to exagerate. They were also strung out on a number of different drugs.

Did it actually happen? I can't say becuase I don't know the girl and wasn't there.

What the media did was make a three ring circus out of the whole mess. The prosecuting DA is going to get busted for being over zealous over this.

My theory is this and it can be completely wrong but.....

I think the girl engaged in prositution, they didn't pay her enough or she got greedy and wanted more after finding out they were rich boys. Thought she could sell her story to the media or to the boys as a blackmail, got it messed up and decided to turn it into a rape case.

OR

She was offered sex for sale, she refused but was strung out enough that a possible rape happened or she was talked into it and then decided later the money wasn't enough and would call it rape at the end.

Either way, girl on drugs bad situation all around. I know frat boys, and drunk frat boys + strippers = bad bad party.

But like I said, I wasn't there and was thankful I wasn't on a jury for this.

(Reply to this) (Thread)

[info]ikilled007
2007-04-14 08:49 pm UTC (link)
Did you know this is the second time she said 3 men raped her?


In 1993, when she was 14 years old, Mangum claimed to have been kidnapped by three men, driven to a house in Creedmoor, N.C., 15 miles away from Durham, and raped. She said one of the men was her boyfriend at the time, and was a physically and emotionally abusive man seven years older than she was. Creedmoor Police Chief Ted Pollard said Mangum filed a report on the incident in Aug. 18, 1996, three years after the rapes allegedly took place. The case, however, was not pursued, because the accuser backed away from the charges out of fear for her life, according to her relatives.

Family members still disagree on what really happened in 1993. The accuser's father has said he believes his daughter was not raped or injured in that incident, while her mother has said a rape involving three men in Creedmoor did occur, but said it happened when her daughter was 17 or 18; Mangum's ex-husband, Kenneth Nathanial McNeill, has said he believes the 1993 rape accusations are true.

According to her father, the year after the alleged Creedmoor rape, Mangum saw a psychiatrist and took prescription medication for a year because trauma from the assault had left her suicidal.

My guess is she was raped in 1993 and then split with reality.

(Reply to this) (Parent)
(no subject) - [info]quotidianlight, 2007-04-14 09:42 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]belindashort, 2007-04-15 05:39 pm UTC

[info]benson3
2007-04-14 08:33 pm UTC (link)
why are rape victims still put on any kind of trial media or otherwise. Just because she can't prove it happened doesn't mean that it didn't happen. Can any one say Kobe Bryant?

(Reply to this) (Thread)

[info]zaeron
2007-04-14 08:53 pm UTC (link)
Because you're not a "rape victim" if there was no rape, and false accusations of rape are immensely damaging to the victim(s) - the men accused.

These men, who admittedly were quite foolish, will spend the rest of their lives with this cloud over their head, despite the fact that the courts found them innocent. There will always be those who continue to feel that those men were guilty, despite all the evidence to the contrary.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)
(no subject) - [info]benson3, 2007-04-14 08:58 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]ms_cantrell, 2007-04-14 09:05 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]zaeron, 2007-04-14 09:07 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]benson3, 2007-04-14 09:15 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]quotidianlight, 2007-04-14 09:25 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]zaeron, 2007-04-14 09:26 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]quotidianlight, 2007-04-14 09:29 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]zaeron, 2007-04-14 09:35 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]quotidianlight, 2007-04-14 09:52 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]zaeron, 2007-04-14 10:01 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]quotidianlight, 2007-04-14 10:16 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]belindashort, 2007-04-15 05:46 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]myskat, 2007-04-15 06:56 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]belindashort, 2007-04-15 07:05 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]myskat, 2007-04-15 07:18 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]belindashort, 2007-04-15 07:30 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]myskat, 2007-04-15 09:49 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]myskat, 2007-04-14 10:21 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]quotidianlight, 2007-04-14 09:59 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]zaeron, 2007-04-14 10:02 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]myskat, 2007-04-14 10:14 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]ikilled007, 2007-04-14 09:11 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]benson3, 2007-04-14 09:17 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]ikilled007, 2007-04-14 09:22 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]benson3, 2007-04-14 09:23 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]sedshe, 2007-04-15 01:33 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]phanatic, 2007-04-14 09:06 pm UTC

[info]itzwicks
2007-04-14 08:36 pm UTC (link)
That girl has issues. There was enough physical evidence to prove that the three players in question were NOT involved with any sexual assault. Do I believe she was raped? I may never know for sure, but you can bet that someone had taken advantage of her at some point. She should still be named (Crystal Magnum), if only as a warning to future guys who wish to pursue her romantically.

The next time someone reports a rape, society should either shield ALL names prior to a verdict being rendered in a court of law, or ALL names should be released without exception. The madness has got to end, and end today.

(Reply to this)


[info]gerardkeating
2007-04-14 08:41 pm UTC (link)

She might belive she was raped, just because two people tell contradictory stories, does not mean one of them lies, one might ben genuinely mistaken.

Here in Ireland, the media are not allowed to name the accused or the victim in rapes cases, this prevents the "trial by media" that was seen in the Duke case.

Freedom of the Press is important, but as the old quote goes "...absolute power corrupts absolutely".

(Reply to this) (Thread)

[info]quotidianlight
2007-04-14 09:20 pm UTC (link)
Especially if she was raped in the past. She might have gotten freaed out and had a flippen flash back! But I agree that names should always be withheld. Just like in kidknapping cases were the kid is later found do we need to know ALL the charges so the poor boys have the entire world know there kidknapper raped and sodamized them. We need to prevent names from being aired. It is dangerous as all hell.

(Reply to this) (Parent)

[info]evilegg
2007-04-14 08:56 pm UTC (link)
Her stripper-ness served to discredited her in some people's eyes, while being black and of low social status made some people WANT to believe her. It's all just too fucked up, which why we're talking about it.

(Reply to this) (Thread)

[info]ikilled007
2007-04-14 09:13 pm UTC (link)
Oh I think you're exactly right.

(Reply to this) (Parent)

[info]myskat
2007-04-14 09:41 pm UTC (link)
I think there was some malice involved. I think she saw an opportunity and went for it. She has quite a history. Oh yeah, and I agree having a stripper was a bit stupid. Ditto on Nifong, I think he smelled a way to get votes and stuck his own foot in hiss ass.

(Reply to this)


[info]blackwolfalpha1
2007-04-14 11:07 pm UTC (link)
I think that the case should have been dropped earlier when individuals involved with the case were changing their stories.

(Reply to this)


[info]gomezticator
2007-04-15 12:29 am UTC (link)
I'm surprised they would go to such lengths to put them on trial and then suddenly say, "Oh wait, this never actually happened." Something does not add up. I know women lie, and I know guys get away with rape, but all I know with this dubious case is that somebody just told a lot of huge lies. Either they did it and boosters/parents/others paid off the judicial system to acquit these rich kids, or this stripper made up one hell of a story, stuck with it, and eventually she was figured out. I honestly cannot tell which way it went.

(Reply to this) (Thread)

[info]sedshe
2007-04-15 03:20 am UTC (link)
Well, not to be rude, but if you can't tell, perhaps you should actually read a little bit about the case then. [info]unclebill35 up there laid it out succintly, with articles published as the case progressed. There's plenty more out there if you just do a little googling.

You suspect somebody paid off the judicial system for an acquittal? Hold on and think about that for a second. There was no acquittal, because there was no TRIAL. The charges were thrown out because the ATTORNEY GENERAL of North Carolina determined that there was absolutely no compelling evidence against the three players. Did they pay him off? The North Carolina Conference of District Attorneys called for Nifong to step down from the case. Did they pay them all off? Do you realize how many lawyers that means they'd have had to pay off, and how much each of those lawyers makes per year, and how much it would take to make it worth their while? They'd also have had to pay off everybody at the party, the other stripper, the cabbie who was driving one of the accused away from the party (at the time he was allegedly raping the woman), the Durham Police Department, the DNA labs that ran the tests, Wachovia Bank, Sprint, and Duke University, not to mention the accusing stripper herself. All those entities provided evidence that indicates that no rape was perpetrated by these men that night. Heh. Pretty soon you're talking about some real money here, eh?

Nifong's hastily thrown-together case against these guys was not suddenly thrown out; it was systematically, neatly, and totally dismantled bit by bit as the evidence rolled in over a matter of months that the players did not commit the crime they were accused of. The incident took place in mid-March last year. The DNA evidence cleared every player on the team by April 10th. One might have thought that would be the end of it, but Nifong then charged two players on the 18th and the third on the 15th of May. I recall thinking that, well, he must have SOMETHING on them or he wouldn't have charged them, but by the time months later that it was revealed that he hadn't even interviewed the accuser it was pretty damned obvious he was simply on a witch hunt.

They aren't angels. They're a bunch of spoiled jock boys who threw a big jock party with strippers and booze and that by some accounts got downright nasty. That does not automatically make them rapists, and certainly doesn't mean that Mumsy and Dadsy can wave a magic wand and make a legitimate lawsuit go away with such utter finality that the prosecuting DA is forced to recuse himself and undergo an investigation that may result in his being disbarred. There was nothing legitimate about this.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)
(no subject) - [info]myskat, 2007-04-15 03:48 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]gomezticator, 2007-04-15 05:00 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]sedshe, 2007-04-16 03:19 pm UTC
I would think that the fact
[info]dragonet2
2007-04-15 02:40 am UTC (link)
That they found biological (DNA) evidence of several other people NOT ANY OF the lacrosse players having sex with her on the rape test should pretty much have proven that they were not invovled in having sex with her. None of the names should have been released to the media until a judgement was determined.

It's all just smoke and mirrors to distract from more serious news. Like Iraq/

Just my 2¢.

(Reply to this) (Thread)
Re: I would think that the fact
[info]juxta_poser
2007-04-15 06:07 pm UTC (link)
Like Brittney Spears psycho behavior and Anna Nicoles baby daddy drama, I agree it's all used as distractors from our biggest problem: IRAQ!

(Reply to this) (Parent)

[info]datavortex
2007-04-15 05:34 am UTC (link)
She made it up. She should be sued for everything she has and tossed into prison to be gang raped by women who have been raped for real.

(Reply to this)


[info]juxta_poser
2007-04-15 05:21 pm UTC (link)
She's a stupid bitch.

(Reply to this)


[info]jlindquist
2007-04-16 09:04 pm UTC (link)
I don't know what to believe. That disturbs me to no end. There appears to be malfeasance on all sides of this case, so who can I trust? The DA who violated ethics by withholding evidence? The defendants who showed themselves to be reprehensible people through their words before or afterwards? The victim (?) whose story changed? The defense attorney who released her name?

The system can't work if it can't be trusted. And by God, it needs to work.

(Reply to this)

Create an Account
Forgot your login?
Login w/ OpenID
English • Español • Deutsch • Русский…